GeForce3 and MTM2 problem

rocketalces · Post by **rocketalces** » Thu May 01, 2003 5:14 pm

I just upgraded form a Hercules Geforce2 MX to a ASUS Geforce3.
Every game looks and performs much better now, with the noticeable exception of MTM2 where antialiasing does no longer work properly.
I couldn't find anything in hardware oriented forums: 256 color games in 640x480 are not really the topic of the day there!
On the other hand, antialiasing has given a second life to MTM2: it looks superb and at a recent LAN party (LaPaMa...) I saw again that people simply can't believe that it's only 640x480. If you haven't done it so far and your graphics card offers this option, you should absolutely try it.
Now here's my problem

1st trial: driver 43.75
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First of all, antialiasing did not work at all with latest 4x.xx drivers. Apparently, this is a bug that was introduced lately: it displays applications using 256 colors (like MTM2) in 256 colors instead of 16 bit thus allowing antialiasing to use calculated intermediate colors to smooth the edges.

2nd trial: driver 3x.xx
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Antialiasing now works, but in the distance you can see thin lines separating the textures, a problem I never had with my old MX.

3rd trial: driver 28.xx
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Main reason for this install is that the GeforceTweakUtility does not work with later versions. Now a have a myriad of D3D options to play with. I guess I have to fiddle with anisotropic filtering and/or mipmapping. It looks better now, but still not as good as with the MX2.
I'm surprised, because in all other applications (i.e. games, lol) the GeForce3 is a huge improvement.

Does anybody experience the same problems? Any link or hints regarding D3D settings are welcome.

Fila · Post by **Fila** » Thu May 01, 2003 10:16 pm

Why you need to use 256 colours?

I have a Leadtek Gf3 Ti 500 (not for long, ATI here i come) and it works no problem with MTM2. I use High Color 16bit at desktop. Tried using Antialiasing (i'm not a fan of it, i don't care) and it worked again no problem.

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"In my restless dreams, I see that town, Silent Hill..." - Mary, Silent Hill 2

rocketalces · Post by **rocketalces** » Thu May 01, 2003 10:35 pm

1) I certainly don't need to display anything in 256 colors, but the 43.xx drivers are apparently using this color depht automatically with MTM2, hence the problem.
2) I had no problem with antialiasing on my Geforce MX2. Maybe it is a specific ASUS problem.

Anybody out there with an ASUS Geforce3?

Post by **Phineus** » Fri May 02, 2003 6:14 am

> in the distance you can see thin lines separating the textures

I've had this ever since I got geforce3. Haven't been able to get rid of it.

I've also tried allocating more texture memory but the game won't run.

ZOtm_BigDOGGe · Post by **ZOtm_BigDOGGe** » Fri May 02, 2003 6:34 am

One mustn't forget that the game MTM2 was optomized for 3DFX VOODOO cards...Nvidia Geforce technology didn't even exist then...

I get around 70 FPS max with my Maxi Gamer Cougar card in Direct3D mode (TNT2, I think), and around 240 fps in 3DFX mode with my Voodoo5 videocard.....

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- BigDOGGe's Boneyard ...The Best Custom Trucks in MTM2 -

Fila · Post by **Fila** » Fri May 02, 2003 7:05 am

I don't see any lines separating in the distance.
And ASUS should be the best cards out there... but i guess they don't like MTM2.

240 fps? Dang this game is optimized. I can't reach that with Gf3.

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"In my restless dreams, I see that town, Silent Hill..." - Mary, Silent Hill 2

rocketalces · Post by **rocketalces** » Sun May 04, 2003 5:32 am

What irritates me most is that I hadn't this problem with my old Geforce2 MX (which solds currently around 20$).
At least I found an explanation for this:
GF2 used supersampling antialiasing (SSAA), which meant that the frame was rendered in a higher resolution and then broken down to the effective display resolution. SSAA had 2 big drawbacks: it implied high costs in terms of bandwith and couldn't work with the cards max resolutions. Therefore it was rarely used, except for games using little bandwidth and low resolution. It seems SSAA was specifically designed for MTM2.
Now for the bad news: apparently GF3 can't do SSAA, but uses another method called multisampling MSAA. Don't ask me for details (more info in the help files of GeforceTweakUtility 3.2 and forums at http://www.guru3d.com/) but the methods are truly different.

At a LAN-party last week, MTM2 ran superbly on all RADEONs (sob..)

Fila · Post by **Fila** » Mon May 05, 2003 3:05 am

MTM2 ran superbly on all RADEONs

Oooooo, i might be enjoying my new.... uhm, but first i must have it in my hands

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"In my restless dreams, I see that town, Silent Hill..." - Mary, Silent Hill 2

ch_2005 · Post by **ch_2005** » Mon May 05, 2003 3:56 am

If anyone has any old cards tell me and i'll give u my mailing address

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Keep on MTMing,
CH_2005 Visit my site

Slickster · Post by **Slickster** » Tue May 06, 2003 12:12 pm

<IMG SRC="http://714.freewebspace.com/textureprobs1.jpg" border=0>

or http://714.freewebspace.com/textureprobs1.jpg

I suppose this is what most of you are referring to. No, I don't remember the fix, lol, but I hope someone does, because Ive had it fixed before.

Slickster · Post by **Slickster** » Tue May 06, 2003 12:17 pm

rofl...I just fixed it..about *looks at watch* 2 minutes later. Turn of Anisotropic Filtering, and it should be fine.

rocketalces · Post by **rocketalces** » Sun May 18, 2003 7:00 pm

Slickster
1) I can't see your picture and I don't know whether we talk about the same thing.
2) Turning off anisotropic filtering doesn't help: the problem remains whatever setting is chosen.

I guess that GF3 antialiasing and the 2 pixel texture overlapping scheme of MTM2 do interfere in some way.
I have tried pretty everything and I give up on this one, at least until someone comes up with a new idea.

Malibu350 · Post by **Malibu350** » Mon May 19, 2003 12:59 am

maybe what you're seeing is normal for this 'older' game... my Kids play some newer games and the graphics look incredibly sharp in comparrison to mtm2 and of course the color depth in those is much higher to boot...

I have two gaming pc's, one uses a gforce2 and the other a gforce4, I just keep the drivers updated and antialiasing set to the max on both to get the best visual results... perhaps if you post a screen shot of what you see on your system we can do a comparrison... it may turn out that (sorry to say) it just doesn't get any better.

Post by **Phineus** » Mon May 19, 2003 1:29 am

> maybe what you're seeing is normal for this 'older' game...

Yes, but apparently normal only on geforce3.

> it may turn out that it just doesn't get any better

You're probably right. But just my luck. My first geforce and it has this glitch.

I don't know if this picture is better than slicks, but here it is in black and white. I've adjusted the contrast so you can see it better, but in game it really looks bad.

<center>

</center>

Fila · Post by **Fila** » Tue May 20, 2003 9:52 am

Holy Phinnies. I don't have that in my game with Gf3.

I love my card (argh, that Radoen takes ages to get here).

Slickster · Post by **Slickster** » Tue May 20, 2003 12:16 pm

meh, I've found alot of options cause it, such as Texture Sharpening. I suggest to download NVHardPage, or any other graphics tweaker, and turn off alot of D3D options.

Mainly, I have AA, Texture Sharpening, and W-Buffer disabled.

Post by **Phineus** » Wed May 21, 2003 2:17 am

Yep, these are the best settings I could find. Anything else and it's checkboard city.

<center>

</center>

rocketalces · Post by **rocketalces** » Wed May 21, 2003 5:22 am

Same for me
Still, it's a shame that AA doesn't work properly with the GF3. On my old GF2 MX (and all those bloody Radeons, lol) MTM2 looks SO MUCH better with AA that you think you see at least a 800x600 resolution.

Fila · Post by **Fila** » Tue Jan 27, 2004 11:48 pm

8x Antialiasing using Gf 5900 Ultra. No problem.

Link to picture[/url]

GeForce3 and MTM2 problem

GeForce3 and MTM2 problem

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